[eDebate] Genetic Engineering--Clearing up one piece of rhetorical manipulation

Andy Ellis andy.edebate
Tue Apr 10 12:17:52 CDT 2007


Some people would like that...those folks dont ever get to debate what they
like...educational topic switching would seem to suggest that having these
unfamiliar debates is a good thing...and why arent these technical questions
important to the policy decisions....arent ill informed policy decisions 1)
circumventable and 2)bad....

On 4/10/07, David Glass <gacggc at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> a technical counterplan would avoid the policy issues (since those
> would be the same for the plan and cp), and offer a highly technical
> net benefit...    maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt people want to debate
> whether it's good or bad to have a CMV vs an SV40 promoter on a
> cloning vector...  good luck writing an aff that doesn't allow me to
> write such cps...
>
> On 4/10/07, Andy Ellis <andy.edebate at gmail.com> wrote:
> > why would we avoid these problems? We have debaters on our college team
> who
> > would school people on the engineering details but typically get lost on
> the
> > policy specific debates....why is it any different to elevate a
> different
> > catagory of academic expertise....i would love to see or example some
> > biology or sceince focused person school some policy makers on the
> applied
> > theory as opposed to the abstract theory...why is this bad....
> >
> >
> > On 4/10/07, David Glass <gacggc at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > As perhaps one of the few genetic engineers on the listserv, I just
> > > wanted to put my 2 cents in on this paper.
> > >
> > > While one can undoubtedly find particular examples of genetic
> > > manipulation that should arguably be banned (such as recloning the
> > > 1918 flu virus, which has been done -  or  a host of potential
> > > bioweapon approches) someone who is knowledgeable in the field could
> > > offer highly technical and defensible counterplans (and disads) which
> > > would be difficult for someone who is not schooled in the field to
> > > answer...
> > >
> > > ... I had a similar concern about a high school topic paper geared at
> > > discussing regulations of the internet; a perusal of the field quickly
> > > revealed the potential for getting bogged down in engineering details
> > > - and it was not obvious how an aff (or a resolution) could be written
> > > to avoid such a problem.
> > >
> > > for example: say you want to ban cloning of the 1818 flu virus; I
> > > could counterplan to clone it without certain pieces of the virulence
> > > factor... say you catch up to that counterplan, I could counterplan to
> > > just clone the envelope of the virus, and not the rest of it... so
> > > that antibodies could be made vs possible bioweapons....     say you
> > > want to ban genetic manipulation in general - for that there are
> > > literally millions of exclusion counter-plans, since such manipulation
> > > is used in most phases of modern pharmaceutical development, in the
> > > US, Europe, India, Brazil, etc, and in almost all basic biological
> > > research programs...    say you wanted to restrict research on a
> > > particular organism, because you have cards that say this is being
> > > used for bioweapons; the counterplan is to just work on defensive
> > > projects, in case others are working on that organism...  say that you
> > > write an aff to just work on defensive projects, but ban all other
> > > study of that organism...  the counterplan would be to allow research
> > > on genes X or Y that might help people to understand a particular
> > > enzyme (protein that has some catalytic function in the organism), but
> > > don't contribute to weaponization potential...
> > >
> > > then there are even more technical issues; such as what cloning
> > > vectors might be allowed, or what promoters to express particular
> > > genes, so as to minimize problems such as weaponization
> > >
> > > then there are even more technical approaches, such as banning a
> > > particular sequence, since that sequence is part of a particularly
> > > dangeous gene... to which one could counterplan to avoid only a
> > > sub-sequence of the suggested ban, etc etc...
> > >
> > >
> > > a rez that restricts the "research, development or use" of genetic
> > > engineering does not obviously avoid these technical issues
> > >
> > > the same issues are probably true of nanotech, since that is also a
> > > widely used technology; though that isn't my field.
> > >
> > > i'm sorry to add a negative voice against this topic; surely a lot of
> > > work was put into the paper...  and obviously I'd be pleased to coach
> > > this topic, since I know a lot about it... but it's not clear to me
> > > that it can be made debatable for most programs...
> > >
> > > just my opinion
> > >
> > > David J. Glass  (M.D)
> > > Edgemont, Harvard Debate
> > > if you want my technical quals, you can look me up on www.pubmed.gov
> > > (type in "Glass DJ[au]".... just the bit between the quotes)
> > >
> > > On 4/9/07, scottelliott at grandecom.net <scottelliott at grandecom.net>
> wrote:
> > > > I just want to clear up what I have found to be a misrepresentation
> of
> > my topic
> > > > paper.
> > > >
> > > > I have NEVER advocated for a topic that merely "regulates" genetic
> > engineering
> > > > and nanotechnology.
> > > >
> > > > The topic porposal I submitted clearly explains why a resolution
> should
> > allow
> > > > the affirmative to restrict the "research, development or use" of
> > genetic
> > > > engineering or nanotechnology through "legislation, regulation, or
> > formal
> > > > international agreement."
> > > >
> > > > I beleive some people have gotten the impression via different
> postings
> > that I
> > > > advocated the mere regulation of these areas of technology in my
> paper.
> > This
> > > > is, at best, a misreading of my paper. I clearly explain why mere
> > regulation
> > > > would not work.
> > > >
> > > > Why?
> > > >
> > > > Well, regualtions are the EXECUTIVE branch's means of enforcing a
> > legislative
> > > > directives. Given that there are few, if any, actual laws
> restricting
> > genetic
> > > > engineering or nanotechnology ( in fact the only legislation
> regarding
> > NANO
> > > > actually mandates an INCREASE in its development)regulations cannot
> be
> > enacted
> > > > in many cases. Also, mere regulation creates the problem of
> > international
> > > > solvency. Only by allowing affirmatives to choose one or more
> solvency
> > > > options--legislation, regulation, or treaties, can they actually
> > accomplish the
> > > > scope of what solvency authors really advocate. (Wouldn't
> consistency
> > with one's
> > > > solvency advocate be great?)
> > > >
> > > > If the topic area were merely "regulation", I too would not choose
> to
> > vote for
> > > > it.
> > > >
> > > > If the topic area is chosen, but the topic committee mutates the
> > resolutions to
> > > > say, "regulation" only, I would not vote for that resolution.
> > > >
> > > > Genetics and nanotechnology is an amazing area of research and the
> > debates among
> > > > experts of how to limit, restrict, or regulate are extremely timely
> and
> > on
> > > > point. I find it sad to think that students are going to spend
> another
> > year
> > > > debating the middle-east morass ( Jeez, hasn't been solved in 10,000
> > years) and
> > > > prolif rather than researching cutting edge issues--many of which
> are so
> > cutting
> > > > edge, their coaches don't even realize they are cutting edge.
> > > >
> > > > Scott
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > eDebate mailing list
> > > > eDebate at www.ndtceda.com
> > > > http://www.ndtceda.com/mailman/listinfo/edebate
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > eDebate mailing list
> > > eDebate at www.ndtceda.com
> > > http://www.ndtceda.com/mailman/listinfo/edebate
> > >
> >
> >
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: http://www.ndtceda.com/pipermail/edebate/attachments/20070410/af0f66bb/attachment.htm 



More information about the Mailman mailing list