[eDebate] reply to Carver

Andy Ellis andy.edebate
Tue Aug 5 20:29:40 CDT 2008

While your RATM story is actually kinda of interesting, even if tangential,
the point is you are asking a rate for tournament pay that is while maybe
fair compensation for your time, a ridiculous level for this community. I
really wish thats what the pay scale here looked like, i do, but its not,
and unless you can Tommie or Zach to ante up the kinda dough that it would
require to pay those kinda rates i think people are going to mock you a
little when you suggest that a weekend worth of your judging is worth an
appalingly high percentage of their salaries...i mean really, i made 6k for
coaching the ceda national champion last year, not as a bonus, but like that
was my take home for the year...that may not be normal, but most people are
just not gonna pay you what you are asking when a recent grad will do it for
200 bucks some floor space and some taco bell...maybe thats your point and
if you have a means to increase the rates to the level of which you speak i
am all ears, but other wise you just sound kinda insane....

On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 9:14 PM, Art Kyriazis <akbiotech at comcast.net> wrote:

> Note to Mr. Carver:
> as Groucho Marx once remarked, I wouldn't want to join a club that would
> have me as a member.  obviously mr. carver thinks the ceda website is some
> kind of place for posting jokes instead of a serious debate website.  I
> posted a very serious note about my availability to judge at two, and only
> two, tournaments, those being  Kings College and Clarion.  I specifically
> emailed the Michigan people that I was unavailable for their judging needs
> due to distance, vacation plans and the un-economical nature of bringing in
> a hired judge all the way from the east coast.  I suggested they hire
> Patrick Rose, Esquire, a former Harvard debater, a very highly skilled trial
> and appellate attorney and policy debate judge who teaches appellate
> advocacy, moot court and civil procedure at Thomas Cooley School of Law.
> i've been doing this policy debate stuff now more than thirty-five years.
> I had a pleasant year last year coaching high school debate.  Guess they're
> more respectful down there.
> I don't expect your immediate respect.  I know I have to earn it.  But I
> take this stuff seriously and I will always flow your rounds and give you a
> fair decision.
> And being serious, there's casual, there's really casual, and then there's
> Shanahan.
> Here's a story.  I remember going to the Grammies and the Sony afterparty
> in New York City with my clients and their friends Tommie Morello and Rage
> Against the Machine about twelve years ago, and even rock stars dress in
> black tuxedo Armani, shirt buttoned, no tie, their women dress in slinky
> designer dresses, and the rap stars dress in expensive ski jackets and very
> expensive sunglasses.  And Armani is a designer, not a kritik.
> Now Rage Against Machine is as radical left as you can get.  Their website
> was actually ordered pulled down by the Bush administration after 9/11
> because it was too radical.  They have spent almost twenty years championing
> the cause of Mumia Abu Jamal's freedom, which in Philly is VERY
> controversial.  And yet they had the courage to come to this town and say
> out loud they wanted the man to be free, even though the cops guarding them
> wanted to kill them for saying it.
> Now I submit, that takes real courage.  Not like hiding behind a computer
> and mocking someone's name.  That is a cowardly and stupid act, by contrast.
> So, Carver, when are YOU going to do something as brave as Tommie Morello
> and Rage Against Machine?  When are you going to stand up for your rights,
> to quote Bob Marley?  What have you done lately to challenge the status quo,
> if you're so radical?
> I mean, there's a dress code and a conduct code even among rock stars.
>  You'd think debaters, who truly wish to be rock stars, would have them too.
>  Rock stars dress a certain way and conduct themselves a certain ethical
> way, at least the good ones like Rage and Bono do.  And Tommie Morello is
> really a humble guy.
> --Art Kyriazis
> Carver wrote:
>> Counter offer:
>> You drive the Kyriasakamistakis mobile to Ann Arbor tonight and I will
>> give
>> you fifteen buck a round to judge my camp tourney debates. You can ever
>> dress like it's a funeral
>> JC
>> On Tue, Aug 5, 2008 at 6:14 PM, Art Kyriazis <akbiotech at comcast.net>
>> wrote:
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